Re: [Y' KIE^'N BA.N NGHE DA`I] Giu'p do*~ Vie^.t nam

[Aiviet Nguyen <aiviet@cat.syr.edu>]

Hi Folks,
   I found Anh Phung Ho Hai's article very interesting. There are
many points that enlightened me. There are few points I would like to 
understand more to change my original thoughts. ( I hate to agree 100%
in any case).
   Let me give few comments:

On Thu, 3 Apr 1997, PHUNG HO HAI wrote:
> ta.i sao ta la.i cho.n tru*o*`ng
> DLTL trong khi o*? Vie^.t nam co`n co' bao nhie^u tru*o*`ng kha'c.

 1) Thang Long is the first "Dda.i ho.c DL" it is most well-known. 
 2) Thang Long asked for helps. We don't know about others. Con co' kho'c 
me. mo+'i cho bu'.
 3) There was an old real story that a foreigner offered his help to a
Vnmese institution and was replied that " if you want to help you have to 
satisfy my conditions". (???!) This is a general attitude.  
 
> Trong nhu*~ng na(m ga^`n da^y nhu ca^`u ho.c ta^.p cu?a thanh nie^n vie^.t
> nam ta(ng le^n nha cho'ng. Co' ra^'t nhie^`u ly' do, mo^.t trong nhu*~ng
> ly' do chi'nh la` na.n tha^'t nhie^.p.
 
    One of the main functions of Univ in the US is also to regulate the 
unemployment rates. That's normal.

> su*. thay do^?i cu*?a
> ne^`n kinh te^' xua^'t hie^.n nhu ca^`u cu?a mo^.t so^' nga`nh mo*'i nhu*
> Qua?n ly' kinh te^' theo kie^?u tu* ba?n, ngoa.i ngu*~,... Ma` ca'c
> tru*o*`ng co^ng kho^ng da'p u*'ng no^?i. Ca'c tru*o*`ng da^n la^.p ra
> do*`i nha(`m da'p u*'ng nhu ca^`u tre^n. 
   
    That's OK. But I don't understand why Thang Long can be named as an 
University. In my definition even Ba'ch Khoa, Thu?y Lo+.i, Kinh te^',...
are not Universities. They would be Schools, Colleges, Institutes,...
Thang Long can be considered as Professional or technical training Center.

> Co' the^? la^'y nga vi' du. la`
> tru*o*`ng da^n la^.p tha(ng long. No' bao go^`m ca'c khoa Toan-Tin, Kinh
> te^' , Lua^.t va` Ngoa.i ngu*~. Xin chu' thi'ch the^m la` Toa'n-Tin nghi~a
> la` Tin ho.c, chu? ye^'u la` tin ho.c va(n pho`ng, ho.c sinh ho.c chu?
> ye^'u ca'ch la^.p tri`nh tre^n mo^.t so^' pha^`n me^`m nhu* foxpro,
> exell... 

      Good point! That's why they need money but not for instance
the "Computer Architecture" by Hennessy. 
 
> gia'o su* Hu`nh mu`i cu~ng 
> ta^'t ca? ca'c hie^.u tru*o*?ng cu?a ca'c tru*o*`ng co^ng o*? Ha`no^.i
> de^`u va^~n dang la` ca'n bo^. a(n lu*o*ng nha` nu*o*.c.

    If the private schools are business, I think according to the VN 
business law a government officer cannot run a private business.
I don't understand this. If the directors keep their positions elsewhere
they will not have enough commitments to the schools and will be 
interested mainly in a short-term money making. 
 
> Ca'c tha^`y du*o*.c mo*`i de^'n da.y va` tra? co^ng theo gio*` da.y. Trung
> bi`nh mo^.t gio*` gia?ng cho khoa?ng 50-100 ho.c sinh du*o*.c 5US$ do^'i
> vo*'i mo.t gia'o su*, it' ho*n ne^'u kho^ng pha?i la` gia'o su*. HO.c sinh
> mo^.t tha'ng no^.p 200.000 ....... To'm la.i la` nho*` danh nghia~ 
> tru*o*`ng tu* ban gia'm hie^.u du*o*.c mo^.t khoa?n lo*.i ke^'ch xu`.

     That's OK. But hopefully the fat profit will have a significant
part reinvested for infrastructure, increasing the standards beyond exell
and lotus. If not, the wrong support will not help them to realize the need
in doing that.
     At startup, I heard that Thang Long received a very strong and generous
support from French-Vnmese. Certainly, after ten years, if they don't manage
themself well, they cannot expect the in-cash support any more. They 
should change their policy and also the leadership if neccessary to be a 
real non-profit NGO. If they did not swim, they will never learn how to.

      I am realy curious about the achivement and expansion of Thang Long 
as a prototype of VN private schools.

> ca'c tru*o*`ng tu*
> du*o*.c la^.p ra vo*'i mu.c di'ch chi'nh la` thu*o*ng ma.i.
 
   That's OK, if a long-term business vision is there. I would like
to know about how many new lab facilities they bought in recent years.
That maybe a good indicator of reinvestment. Or the director boards also 
invested the whole budget into Land and now are threatened with the
prospect of going bankcrupt under the Banking Crisis. If so, let them go, 
new player will come and need our money. 

> Nhu*ng tru*o*`ng tu* chi? co'
> ta'c du.ng mo*? mang da^n tri' chu*' kho^ng the^? da`o ta.i nha^n ta`i cho
> da^'t nu*o*'c.

    This cannot be universally true. ( Havard, Standford are all private).
Even in VN, it cannot be true in the long-term. If we decide to support
it is just because we want to make this statement invalid. ( Regardless
who said the inverse).
    On the other hand, at the moment I bet that "Mo+? mang Da^n tri'" is
more important than " Dda`o ta.o Nha^n ta`i". Most VN talents are educating
themself. ( I am not talking about the basic education, which is more 
important than the higher one in my opinion.)

> Thu*' nha^'t la` ne^n giu'p do*~ ca'c tru*o*`ng co^ng, va` ca'c trung
> ta^m khoa ho.c. Ca'c tru*o*`ng
> co^ng bao go^`m ca? pha^`ng gia?ng day va` nghie^n cu*'u. 

   Question: How. It is more difficult to help an abstract concept.
Only Government can handle such a large scale support including salary in 
the public sector ( hence the name public). I think that best way
is to help the concrete persons you know with books, facilites. If there 
is some way to organize some funds or propose the US or any government
to support VN education and cultural exchange projects ( for instance
publish scientific and text books with the title: The gift of (...government,
foundation,...) to Vnmese people.)
    I don't support the help in cash in this case. DHS are not rich and that 
money cannot be guaranteed to go to the Bank Crisis. If they are not enthusiatic
with intellectual values as with cash, why we should support.
   It is not to say that I am against the in-cash help. It is OK if we 
are sure that the money is usefully used.
   If I were in charge of a private school, after a long enough time ( said
5-10 years) I would ask a bank to help me to distribute the shares of the 
school for fund raising. In this case, if you want to send a gift to calm
you desire of an easy patriotism, just go ahead. But if you believe that
you want to get the money back, I would say that such certificates don't 
have any legacy values. I have paid enough such certificates and have 
never seen any return. It should be clarified from the beginning. 

> Va^'n
> de^` la` cha^'t lu*o*.ng sa'ch. Ca'c chuye^n gia pha?i da?m ba?o sa'ch co'
> gia' tri. su*? du.ng. Du*`ng gu*?i nhu*~ng thu*' "vu*'t di thi` tie^'c".

    The problem is that the experts cannot send their own books that they
are intensively using. They can ask for donations but in the most case they
cannot evaluate them very carefully.


> Do^'i vo*'i sinh vie^n thi` text books la` quan tro.ng nha^'t. Ne^'u ca'c
> ba.n kho^ng co' die^`u kie^.n gu*?i sa'ch thi` co' the^? photocopy la.i.

    Textbooks are obviously very important and you can send as many copies
as you can. Photocopies cannot take care of the need except few monograph.
Textbooks are also very stable. But we need a personal contact to make sure
that they are needed to send to a right place.The place of Excell and 
Lotus may not need the "Inside OLE" or " Inside Unix design"...

    My approach is a litle bit more essential and effective. If we can
raise a fund to translate textbooks into Vnmese, that would be good.
Let me explain this:
     1) The publishing companies want to make money so they don't care 
about textbooks and additional readings, as these books should be cheap 
enough.
     2) We have to face the fact that the majority of Vnmese students
don't read English books as most of us are. The day when all students can use
English freely is still far ( Only God and maybe Chi Hai Judy know
 when:-)) And I doubt that all professors can use English at will.
     3) The tearchers who would be hired to do translations will i) learn
the topics ii)learn English iii) don't have da.y the^m for money iv)
develope Vnemese terminology ( I think this is also important)
     4) What we have to do is:i) To pay the printing cost ( in Vn it can 
not be high) ii) To pay the low cost of translation iii) To ask for the 
copy right ( or pay it at low cost. One of my friend who wrote a Physics 
Textbook, gave VN a free copyright) iv) Aks for publishing permission in VN.
     5) A lot of government and business organizations would support if
on the first page there is a sentence " The gift from...". Good commercial
add or good propaganda!
     
> Do^'i vo*'i vie^.c nghie^n cu*'u thi` ngoa`i sa'ch ra ta.p chi' ra^'t qua
> tro.ng. Die^`u na`y kho' nhu*ng ne^'u ai co' the^? xin fund de^? mua
> du*o*.c ta.p chi' cho vie^.t nam thi` la` mo^.t great job.
  
   Chi. Hai Judy Ladinsky did a great job in this thing. If she is not so 
busy she can do more.

> Thu*' hai la` hie^.n nay do nhie^`u ly' do, kinh te^' cu~ng nhu* ta^m
> ly'(do dua do`i) ca'c sinh vie^n vie^.t nam chu? ye^'u cho.n ca'c nga`nh
> kinh te^', tin ho.c va(n pho`ng, ngoa.i ngu*~. vo*'i da` na`y 10 naa(m
> nu*~a ngu*o*`i vie^.t nam se~ no'i tie^'ng anh hoa(.c tie^'ng hoa thay vi`
> tie^.ng vie^.t, ta^'t ca? se~ tro*? tha`nh managers, nhu*ng vie^.t nam
> va^~n se~ xua^'t kha^?u da^`u tho^ cu~ng nhu* ga.o ke'm cha^'t lu*o*.ng.
> Ca'c managers khi o^'m cha('c pha?i ra nu*o*'c ngoa`i chu*~a be^.nh
> vi` trong nu*o*'c he^'t ba'c si~. Vi` va^.y theo y' to^i chu'ng ta ne^n
> giu'p do*~ vie^.t nam da`o ta.o ca'c ky~ su* ho*n ba'c si~ ho*n la`
> ca'c nha` qlkt.
     
    Don't worry about this. The Market economy will take care about that.
Additionally, it is impossible that everybody will become manager.
I don't believe that our average foreign language standard is already
satisfactory let alone your warning.

> Ga^`n da^y ca'c ba.n An Ha?i va` Vu~ (Ha` Anh Vu~ ?) co' post ca'c tho^ng
> tin ve^` vie^.c la`m Ph.D o? mi~. 

  In my opinions, you can publish the information on Tuo^?i Tre?, Tie^`n 
Phong, Lao ddo^.ng,...
  The big names usually are busy, they don't have the need to go for PH.D.
They don't have the duty to do an additional job. And ...Vnmese sentiment...
And the list of Anh Phung Ho Hai is far from complete, why we don't send 
information to other places....Said, what I should do if I were Mr. Ngo 
Viet Trung. The best I could do is to call my people and say " Hey, look 
at that, if you are interested". That 's All. Newspaper is accessible to 
everybody.
  Perhaps, an advice about how to start for a student in Vinh, who does 
not have any connection and any body to ask opinion would be practical 
and useful. For him, the application process and TOEFLE and ... are in 
Chinese.
 
> Ca~m o* ca'c ba.n da~ do.c xong ca'i message da`i do`ng va` ra('c ro^'i
> na`y, to^i nga`y xu*a ho.c va(n ke'm ne^n gio*` vie^'t kho^ng ra`nh ma.ch.
> Tha^n,
> Phu`ng Ho^` Ha?i
> 
> 
Cheers
Aiviet